Looking ahead to 2018 aka 2017-18 Offseason SOX Haps

Discussion in 'SOXual Healing' started by maurice, Aug 21, 2017.

  1. IWMB
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    IWMB Resident Umpire

  2. y2chae
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    y2chae Panda

    I'm usually not the 'intangibles' guy but I believe Abreu has more value to the Sox than any other team right now due to him being Cuban and an older mentor type for Moncada and Robert. So I only trade him in a deal you can't turn down. With Devers graduating, the Red Sox system is kind of thin now. Their top pitching prospect, Jay Groome, struggled at A ball, although it was a small sample size. Their top hitting prospect Chavis is intriguing but right now he seems to profile as a Matt Davidson type. I'd want more.
    maurice likes this.
  3. maurice
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    maurice Gangster of Love

    :helloexactly:
  4. maurice
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    maurice Gangster of Love

    :check:
  5. IWMB
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    IWMB Resident Umpire

    Want a cookie?
    chops likes this.
  6. Cheeses
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    Cheeses Do not be afraid to crush the cucks with your mind Cupcake Mod

  7. maurice
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    maurice Gangster of Love

    What kind of cookie?
  8. Iwritecode
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    Iwritecode Writing Code Again

    Fortune, obviously.
  9. whitesox901
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    whitesox901 Banjo and Kazui's great adventure

  10. zmz
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    zmz By the Banks of the River Chicago



    :ecstasy:
  11. y2chae
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    y2chae Panda

  12. maurice
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    maurice Gangster of Love

    Not unless he signs a friendly extension.

    In other words, Sox not actually interested.
  13. y2chae
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    y2chae Panda

    He'd definitely have to sign an extension but I don't know about friendly. The Sox will have a ton of money to spend after 2018 (no bad contracts and possibly Abreu and Avi off the books) and the window should start to open at 2019 at the latest. If the Sox could get him for 8 years $240 million, I think you have to strongly consider that. Of course even that deal could probably be considered under market value at this point.
  14. sycked
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    sycked If you loved me, you'd all kill yourselves today.

    10 years and probably a record setting amount of $$ until Harper and Trout hit free agency?

    :soexcited:
  15. y2chae
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    y2chae Panda

    But at the same it would make no sense to give up 1 or 2 elite prospects just to get Machado a year early. If the Sox feel they could get him to take a slight discount and sell him on being the face/missing piece of the rebuild, why wouldn't you wait until he hits free agency?
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  16. y2chae
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    y2chae Panda

    Harper hits free agency the same offseason.
  17. sycked
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    sycked If you loved me, you'd all kill yourselves today.

    Yeah, I knew that. I just figured that nothing will happen in terms of a trade unless an extension happens, too. Only makes sense to go after him for a 1 year rental if he's the last piece for a contender.

    We will see.
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  18. chops
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    chops never met prope

    Dude is only 25, https://www.baseball-reference.com/players/m/machama01.shtml

    I agree, sign his ass in 2019, why trade anything for him now? Not like the '18 SOX are gonna be awesome. (or maybe they will be)
  19. y2chae
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    y2chae Panda

    The Royals and Tigers are going to be awful in 2018 so the Sox will most likely be the 3rd best team in the Central. What that means who knows.

    Neither the Royals or Tigers have a good farm. The Royals might have the worst in baseball. The Tigers can at least trade Castellanos, Iglesias and Fulmer. Meanwhile the Royals are going to lose in free agency Cain, Hosmer, Moustakas and the guy who was their best starter last year in Vargas.
  20. skottyj
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    skottyj Owner of Many Baseball Hats


    If the Sox are going to be awful next year might as well give up the 1 elite prospect cause you know the Orioles will give him the qualifying offer so you would lose your draft pick if you sign him in free agency? At least get rid of one thing you know for sure and take the crap shoot in the draft?
  21. y2chae
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    y2chae Panda

    I believe picks in the top half cannot be used for compensation
  22. skottyj
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    skottyj Owner of Many Baseball Hats

    Pretty sure its the first 10 and even if you pick in the top ten then you lose your second round pick.
  23. y2chae
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    y2chae Panda

    Yeah you still lose a pick, but hypothetically losing a sandwich or 2nd round pick to sign Machado, no one would oppose that.
  24. IWMB
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    IWMB Resident Umpire

    :lastweek:

    New rules!

    https://www.si.com/mlb/2017/11/07/mlb-free-agency-compensation-rules-draft-picks-qualifying-offer

    If your team signs a qualified free agent, it still has to surrender a draft pick. However, that's no longer its top unprotected pick by default. Instead, here's what your team will give up:

    • If your team exceeded the luxury tax last season, it will forfeit its second- and fifth-highest picks and will have its international bonus money pool reduced by $1 million; an additional qualified free agent will cost the team its third- and sixth-highest picks. In other words: All first-round picks are now protected, and the highest pick a team can lose is from the compensatory sandwich round immediately following the first round.

    • If your team received revenue sharing last year, it will forfeit its third-highest pick. An additional player will cost the team its fourth-highest pick.

    --

    So that's what a team gives up to sign a qualified free agent. But what does the team losing the player gain in exchange?

    If your team received revenue sharing last year and the departing player signed a contract worth more than $50 million guaranteed, the former team will receive a compensatory draft pick from the sandwich round between Rounds 1 and 2. If the player signs a deal for less than $50 million, however, that pick will come after Competitive Balance Round B, which comes after Round 2.

    But there's more! If the former team was over the luxury tax last year, then it will receive a compensatory draft pick after the fourth round. If the team was neither a luxury tax payee nor a revenue sharing recipient, then it will receive a pick after Competitive Balance Round B.
  25. chops
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    chops never met prope

    Lots of chatter on twitter about the SOX having the best offer for Manny. Kopech or Giolito, but not both

    I didn't read any article, just the tweets from Rosenthal, etc.

    interesting, if true.
  26. skottyj
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    skottyj Owner of Many Baseball Hats

    THURSDAY, 4:04am: A source close to Bruce Levine of CBS Chicago confirms Rosenthal’s earlier report that the White Sox are one of the lead teams for Machado.

    Infield of Abreu; Moncada; Anderson and Machado? Yes please.
    chops likes this.
  27. s=D
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    s=D Message Board Historian

    Machado's second most similar player profile is Joe Crede per baseball-reference. Someone besides spiffie please try to sell me that Machado is worth giving up top talent for and hoping he signs a long ass contract guaranteeing him $200 million+
    Last edited: Dec 14, 2017 at 9:01 AM
  28. whitesox901
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    whitesox901 Banjo and Kazui's great adventure

    Agreed with Dorf.

    Machado wants to move to SS, so I'd assume we'd ship out Anderson to Baltimore.
  29. IWMB
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    IWMB Resident Umpire

    FWIW, that's the most similar batter profile. Machado is much better defensively.

    That's also looking at their entire careers IE: Machado at 25 has equaled Crede's entire offensive production across his lifetime.

    Better comp:
    So, a HOFer and a future no doubter.
    Last edited: Dec 14, 2017 at 10:32 AM
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  30. skottyj
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    skottyj Owner of Many Baseball Hats

    Most similar by age is Adrian Beltre. He sucked.

    Machado three time All-Star before age 25; Joe Crede one time in his career.
    Machado 3 seasons in a row of at least 33 homers; Crede hit 30 once.

    But basically the same player.
  31. s=D
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    s=D Message Board Historian

    Great. Wait a year to throw money at him and keep the talent. Maybe we will be a .500 team by then
  32. skottyj
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    skottyj Owner of Many Baseball Hats

    I don't think you're giving away the farm for him; it's a one year "rental". I don't think; at least I hope the plan wasn't to stockpile all this talent then just give it away. This is a move I think you have to make just to show that we're serious about this. He's also 25 fucking years old; this isn't getting Ken Griffey Jr in 2008. You can also get in on him before Harper breaks the bank next year and shit can hit the fan. If Harper becomes the first to cash in for over 400mil this may end up being a bargain in like the 5th year or so.
    sycked likes this.
  33. chops
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    chops never met prope

    Trade and extend and :sexyparty:

    2018 WORLD CHAMPS!
  34. samram
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    samram Bon Vivant

    If they don't get a 72 hour window to extend him, then maybe it's Anderson, Giolito/Kopech, one more starter further down in the system. If they get the window and the trade is contingent on an extension, then obviously they can give up more- i would think the only untouchables are Moncada, Jimenez, and Robert.

    On MLB Radio this morning, they speculated that the Sox may actually like some prospects on the Yankees and the Yankees want Machado. So the Sox would broker a deal for the Yankees because the O's won't deal him directly to the Yankees. I mean, if the Sox could deal Anderson/Giolito/one more starter and end up with Torres, that would be really solid. Probably wishful thinking, but shit, at this time last year, I didn't think the Sox would have the best farm system in the game 6 months later.
  35. y2chae
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    y2chae Panda

    If you trade Anderson, Rutherford and Cease for him without an extension, I think that's worth it. Give him a year to settle in and I'm not saying he'll take a hometown discount to stay but maybe if the final offers are within $1-2 million a year, he takes less with the Sox if he likes the organization. I know Manny was born and raised in the US but he is also of Dominican heritage. Perhaps he likes the clubhouse with a Spanish speaking manager.
    maurice likes this.
  36. y2chae
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    y2chae Panda

    Sox take Carlos Tocci in the Rule V draft. He's already MLB ready on defense at CF but not much of a bat. Seems like an Engel type.
  37. IWMB
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    IWMB Resident Umpire

    And then sent him to Texas for cash

    #baseballbulls
  38. samram
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    samram Bon Vivant

    They already flipped him to Texas for cash.
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  39. IWMB
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    IWMB Resident Umpire

  40. chops
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    chops never met prope

    I don't understand the rule 5 draft, but good on the SOX?
  41. samram
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    samram Bon Vivant

    I guess Baltimore says no window for extension, so it has to be a rental price.

    Reading Hahn's comments, he seems to think they need another year to figure out who they say they like and who they actually like (excluding some no-brainers).
  42. whitesox901
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    whitesox901 Banjo and Kazui's great adventure

    What’s the rental cost?
  43. chops
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    chops never met prope

    Rental price is cheaper, I assume?

    Maybe he can make a deal.
  44. samram
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    samram Bon Vivant

    Cheaper.

    If they end up just staying the course and going after free agents next year, that's fine by me.
  45. zmz
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    zmz By the Banks of the River Chicago

    Remember when wsi didn't want to trade Crede for A-Rod?
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  46. skottyj
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    skottyj Owner of Many Baseball Hats


    I read it costs 100k to make a pick so if they got anything more than that it's 100% free money. Why not do it?
  47. SABRSox
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    SABRSox Hollywood Mega-Hunk Bob Balaban Cupcake Mod

    This is a stupid comment. Teal police?
  48. skottyj
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    skottyj Owner of Many Baseball Hats

    Yeah; I think Adrian Beltre sucked.
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  49. SABRSox
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    SABRSox Hollywood Mega-Hunk Bob Balaban Cupcake Mod

    :thumbsup:

    Excuse me while I leave an offering at my Joe Creede bobblehead shrine now.
  50. Cheeses
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    Cheeses Do not be afraid to crush the cucks with your mind Cupcake Mod

    Even I got Skotty's sarcasm, SABR.

    :cmon:
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